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why were strikers killed?
Same reason capitalists hired Pinkertons to beat strikers over the head in the US. If workers don't work, nobody gets paid.
Strikers in the US were occupying the property of factory owners - and beating up any "strikebreakers".
In communism workers had a legal obligation to work - just abstaining from work (or leaving the factory) was enough to unleash the whips.
That's a misconception. It wasn't the strikers got beat for simply striking. They got beat up for striking and then assaulting the scabs and messing with factory operations. That's a very big difference.
>exercizing anything remotely resembling political agency outside of the party in a communist society
Commies always do the opposite of what they promise:
>land to peasants!
>Collectivize all the land and peasants don't actually own land anymore
>millions die
>class consciousness: bourgeois and nobles cannot understand needs of proletarians
>sons of nobleman, rich landlords and well-off families are leaders of the revolution
>The Russian Empire is the Prison of the peoples and our regime is free
>you can emigrate from Russian Empire but you can't leave the socialistic paradise
>Mass surveillance and oppression on a scale never seen before
>WWI is awful
>to stop it we will start civil war with 8-10 times more deaths
>we are the representatives of the people and the champions of democracy
>Lose the 1917 election, the people actually like other parties more
>democracy has failed us
>Disband the democratically elected government and establish a dictatorship
>Russia produces abundant amount of food was a huge exporter of food stuffs under the Tsar
>40 years of wise bolshevik government
>Russia spends gold reserve to buy wheat
>Claims to be Party of the Workers and Peasants
>Brutally suppress workers's movement for better working conditions and higher wages
>Confiscate peasant's produce and land
>Violently put down starving farmers's uprising
Stalin and Mao were lower class in charge.
Maybe you want to start all over.
Stalin had to climb over the bodies or people exactly like anon described to get to the top. The whole ideology was thought up by people exactly like anon described.
*of people exactly like anon described
Mao is the son of rich landlord/merchant
That's just Russian politicians being Russians though. You think a communist Ireland would be this autistic and psychotic?
Probably not. But a commie Ireland would still have shortages and big civil right violations. But without the pograms and mass killings and deportations.
Ireland and western europe has a large and relatively educated middle class that tempered the excesses of potential communist revolution. Russia was semi-feudal with a tiny educated elite and a fuck ton of gullible illiterate peasants, plus some ambitious semi-educated peasants who don't fully understand the consequences of their actions but is uncultured enough to be ruthless. It's these ambitious semi-educated peasants who would make up the 2nd generation top-level commie leadership(Stalin, Krushchev, etc) and most local-level leadership
commies are economic incels
>WWI is awful
>to stop it we will start civil war with 8-10 times more deaths
Unironically based. How do we get this started up in America?
Almost like communism simply cannot and will not work. Closest thing that works is socialism aka welfare state and that only works bc they tax the shit out of capitalism.
>be one of the best paid professions with special stores selling cheap luxury goods for you, frequent vacations etc
>chimp out
>actually win
>your wages get slashed and extra benefits disappear
Lol
aside from novocherkassk which strikes did the soviets open fire on?
Not USSR, but beating striking workers to death complaining about sausage prices wasn't uncommon in Poland and Czechoslovakia IIRC.
this did happen in reality?
because I can cite several different occasions when LIBERALS opened fire on striking workers
Doesn't matter, that aere probably commie subhumans
they just wanted better pay
what made you such a bootlicker?
Novocherkassk in the USSR
The Bolsheviks had striking train workers shot during the early days of the civil war
>they were wreckers/fascists/subversives/spies!
Correct
In the hard times discipline and grip on the power > humanity and principles. You can run around with the dreams of good government for all day but nobody would care if you'll be killed or stripped off the power before you even manage to do anything
they're both shit, leftcoms are the only answer
Kronstadt sailors said 'free speech for other leftists please' and got fucking bombed lmao
>Leftists killing slightly different leftists
That's nothing new or shocking though tbf
you referring to the Kronstadt rebellion?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kronstadt_rebellion
>give the working man civil rights!
>*gets bombed*
the scale of killings was astronomically lower, you have to scrape the barrel for examples from the19th century and the most notorious example, the homestead strike, the strikers were the aggressors, seizing the mill and firing first on the innocent pinkerton boys just doing their job
>you have to scrape the barrel for examples from the19th century
how much are you getting payed to shill on LULZ for your corporate overlords?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Blair_Mountain
oh right, so instead of the numbers killed by communists being 100000 times greater it was only 10000 times greater, got it
were they? when? please be specific
>WHAT ABOUT
yes, its OK to kill workers as long as you're not communist
>point at someone else to draw attention away from the crimes of your ideology
>rhetorical fallacy is uncovered
>strawmans the other party
>ask for example when alleged killings occurred
>get none
>present examples of capitalists killing workers
>"noooo you cant do that its a whataboutism!"
kill yourself you disgusting rat
>>get none
see
>no sources
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988_Polish_strikes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novocherkassk_massacre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prague_Spring
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarian_Revolution_of_1956
only the first and the second are strikes, and it was only in the Novocherkassk massacre where people were killed (26 to be precise).
>i-it was a strike!
It was a perfectly legitimate rebellion with perfectly valid demands.
>n-no don't defend yourself!
a strike isnt really about defending yourself thou, is it?
This guy should have been you
#
ok but a strike still is not about defending yourself
a strike is to stop work in order to force an employer to comply with demands
>I'm going to divert attention from the hypocrisy of leftists by starting an argument over the dictionary differences between strikes and rebellions, which the communists suppressed anyway in both cases even when made by fellow leftists in good faith or trying to defend themselves
you're the one who brought up examples that were rebellions, not strikes
a rebellion is not a strike
>you're the one who brought up examples that were rebellions
I was not that guy. Anyway:
rebellion != strike
Both strike and rebellion are a kind of resistance, both crushed by commies.
Rebellions in general are crushed by the current government. Doesn't matter if they're communists or not because the state needs to crush the rebellion in order to survive.
And when it comes to "crushing resistance" in the form of strikes, the US has a far higher death count than the USSR.
So the whole "you are communist you fight for the workers how can you kill workers?" argument seems kind of silly when the communists kills a lot less workers than the capitalists.
meds. now.
>Please stop taking our food we are starving!
>Lmao no we're going to gas you and send the Cheka to kill you all
>rebellion = strike
this is your brain on neoliberalism
I think OP was talking about strikes after the civil war
So do I
strike = not working
rebellion = seizing property and trying to kill the people sent to ward you off
I would agree with this statement.
A strike is a form of rebellion.
Rebellion is resisting authority, strikers are resisting in a more peaceful manner but they resist nonetheless
My conclusion from reading this thread is that Americans are so cucked from centuries of abuse by their corpo owned government that they do not even know what a strike is. Americans cant tell the difference between a strike and a rebellion, and even thou they think all rebellions are good, the also think that all strikes are bad and that anyone who goes on strike is a communist and thus deserves to die.
meds
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novocherkassk_massacre
Russians are just like that
>torture
>mass murder
>one shithouse regime replaced with another shithouse regime
>starvation despite having plenty of arable land
There, I've summarised Russian history for you.
Makes you wonder why the average puts up with it? If I were russian after a major revolution I would fight for indepdent courts and a military controlled by civilians and a constitution that provided ample civil rights and legislatures at the local and state and federal levels. Weak power for the govenors and presidents with most of it laying out most power to the legislatures and the president only having power over the military.
what about that 2% of the US population that is currently enslaved?
completely unrelated because were talking about violently suppressing strikes
>NO YOU DIDN'T MAKE US PROSPEROUS LIKE THE WEST OVERNIGHT, DESPITE US BEING IN THE MIDDLE OF A CIVIL WAR FUCK THE BOLSHEVIKS, NO WAIT WHY ARE YOU KILLING ME I'M A FELLOW WORKER NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!
did nothing wrong
>1 million dead vietnamese and even more given cancer with illegal chemical weapons because they voted for communism
>.... democratic western freedom.....
>bolsheviks kill like 20 people
>SEE THEY ARE THE HYPOCRITES!!!!!!!
always funny seeing imperialists gaslight
Because strikers began to loot and assault other people.