Not an especially distinctive voice or memorable songs. I also think that "Those Lazy Hazy Crazy Days of Summer" damaged his reputation as that was not only a hopelessly corny mompop album but it was one of his biggest sellers.
that's not a fair comparison because MG was an entire generation younger than Nat, he came up as the soul era was beginning. i don't dispute however that Nat obviously stuck to making inoffensive music that white people could listen to.
maybe because Sinatra is a good looking WHITE man and whoever that is is an inherently unnatractive BLACK one?
almost like white people are inherently more pleasing to the eyes for any sane human in any culture... wow...
shut the FUCK UP I don't give a fuck how talented someone who is UGLY is and ALL black "people" are UGLY he could've made music so good it cures cancer and even if I HAD cancer I still wouldn't listen to it
Michael Jackson outsold Frank Sinatra, but yes racism probably played a role in him not being as popular as Sinatra as you can still see ‘people’ hung up over race today.
lots of people smoke and they don't die at 45 (Sinatra lived to 82 despite prodigious smoking and drinking). i think he was genuinely depressed at all the racism he experienced in his life and kind of just checked out.
Lots of people experience racism too, Dick Gregory made it to 84. That nigga and Barry White smoked like chimneys and I think that’s what killed them, myself.
>When asked if he loved his son, Marvin Sr. reportedly stated in a soft voice, "Let's say I didn't dislike him."
that's fucked up man. glad i have a good relationship with my dad
>singing about sex and gyrating on stage
Sinful >murder to prevent singing about sex
What God would have wanted
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
i'm still a bit conflicted about religion tbh.on one hand i don't want to seem like a smug fedora atheist but on the other hand the bible has messed up parts like when god sends some bears to kill children. also many of my favorite singers like elvis and stevie wonder sang religious songs so i feel a bit hypocritical listening to those while not being devout
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
I’m not religious but I do worship God (nature, life, being alive), the Bible is too convoluted to me and church folks are some of the biggest cooks in my life. Jesus Christ is alright with me though, I love Elvis Presley religious songs I don’t think it makes much of a difference if I’m a sinner going to Hell and enjoying them simultaneously.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
yeah i think you're right. even as a non devout i think those songs stand up on their own just based off their quality
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>but on the other hand the bible has messed up parts like when god sends some bears to kill children
Bad translation. In the original Hebrew they were teenage boys not literal children.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
ah well. still even if the teens were being dickheads to the bald guy i don't think they deserved to get mauled
?list=PL6law6Uk-M4EwGH12a_9_mDdClmcmB8Bm
Yeah this definitely sounds cheesy compared to his jazz crooner work, but to be fair a couple of bad albums hasn't soured people's opinions on other legends. People still love Elvis even if a lot of his work consisted on forgettable movie soundtracks
one time I saw a music documentary where they interview some boomer black DJ and he mentions the early '60s R&B scene and was like (in reference to Those Lazy Hazy Crazy Days of Summer) "That particular record wasn't one we were too fond of."
sinatra got in on the ground floor with dorsey and harry james in addition to being an actor which helped his popularity
nat was a pianist first and foremost who headed a pretty good trio and performed with buddy rich and lester young
that does not lend itself to popularity and as his sound became more sophisticated through the years he lost his original jazz audience
a shame that jazz fans are allergic to vocal jazz almost as much as swing
the other problem as I see it was that Nat began his recording career postwar when mainstream pop got a lot more dull and toothless compared to the big band era. therefore he tended to be lumped in with the Patti Page school of postwar dishwater pop.
keep in mind that Nat had been performing with his band since the late 1930s when he was a kid although they didn't actually get a recording contract until after WWII. they only recorded that way for a few years and by 1949 were starting to move to big band/orchestra goop that a lot of jazz fans regarded as a sellout.
The last time he played piano very much on record was 1956's After Midnight. He rerecorded several 78 era tunes on modern hi fi stereo in 1961's The Nat King Cole Story. NKCT mostly predates tape recording so it's in direct to disc fuzz.
keep in mind that Nat had been performing with his band since the late 1930s when he was a kid although they didn't actually get a recording contract until after WWII. they only recorded that way for a few years and by 1949 were starting to move to big band/orchestra goop that a lot of jazz fans regarded as a sellout.
albums like Looking Back, Dear Lonely Hearts, Where Did Everybody Go?, and Lazy Hazy Days Of Summer are overburdened with gross 50s-60s orchestra cheese
He follows something of the same career arc as Dean Martin and Sinatra where the Capitol stuff is more brassy uptempo big band while the later Reprise recordings lean into a 60s MOR/pop country style. Dear Lonely Hearts is patterned after Ramblin' Rose, which is in no small part what Dean's later Reprise albums were patterned after. Those Lazy Hazy Crazy Days was a variation on that, with Sing Along With Mitch added in the pot. Looking Back was a comp (made after Nat's passing and with added overdubs) of some of Nat's R'n'R-lite singles, which were attempts to cross over a bit (think of some of Frank's more afield, for him, from the mid-60s)
>When Cole moved to Los Angeles after the war, he was the first black resident of Beverly Hills. He received a housewarming gift when the KKK burned a cross on his law.[3]
He was very talented but simply too square. He was to Sinatra as Mercer was to Crosby. A really good second place not to be scoffed at. His piano ability was incredible though.
Speaking of him and mercer this is one of my favorites
Not an especially distinctive voice or memorable songs. I also think that "Those Lazy Hazy Crazy Days of Summer" damaged his reputation as that was not only a hopelessly corny mompop album but it was one of his biggest sellers.
>or memorable songs
route 66? unforgettable? nature boy? for sentimental reasons?
>route 66
the Bing Crosby/Andrews Sisters and the Rolling Stones' version of that one are better
It was also one of Nat's earliest recordings and his singing got a lot better. He sounds very amateurish on here.
Even though I generally prefer jazzy piano over big band brass the Bing Crosby version blows it away in performing, catchiness, and melodic sense.
yet Bing later refused to cover Nature Boy as he said there was no way he could improve on it and would only butcher the song if he tried
fair enough, but i personally prefer the rhythm on the nat version.
>Not an especially distinctive voice or memorable songs.
cringe zoomer's hot take
racism
GET OUT OF MY HEAD!
I think he was also given a shellacking by rock critics because he was a black musician who did not perform R&B or blues.
Yeah it seems like he's considered too "white sounding" by some critics who prefer edgier stuff
It’s true, Marvin Gaye wanted to croon as well but opted for R&B/soul and Motown due to sales
that's not a fair comparison because MG was an entire generation younger than Nat, he came up as the soul era was beginning. i don't dispute however that Nat obviously stuck to making inoffensive music that white people could listen to.
well he was good at what he did, even if it was inoffensive. not everyone can be a soulful brother à la james brown or prince
doesn't sound bad, but it sounds softer than what i'd expect from a crooner
maybe because Sinatra is a good looking WHITE man and whoever that is is an inherently unnatractive BLACK one?
almost like white people are inherently more pleasing to the eyes for any sane human in any culture... wow...
kill yourself retard
shut the FUCK UP I don't give a fuck how talented someone who is UGLY is and ALL black "people" are UGLY he could've made music so good it cures cancer and even if I HAD cancer I still wouldn't listen to it
Michael Jackson outsold Frank Sinatra, but yes racism probably played a role in him not being as popular as Sinatra as you can still see ‘people’ hung up over race today.
I will add that I love his version of "Frosty the Snowman."
the poor dude was always manically depressed and his music gives off that vibe. it isn't surprising that he died at such an early age.
Smoking a cigar before each vocal session will do that to you, his daughter died young as well she was pretty
lots of people smoke and they don't die at 45 (Sinatra lived to 82 despite prodigious smoking and drinking). i think he was genuinely depressed at all the racism he experienced in his life and kind of just checked out.
Lots of people experience racism too, Dick Gregory made it to 84. That nigga and Barry White smoked like chimneys and I think that’s what killed them, myself.
i think he meant marvin gaye. pretty sure marvin attempted suicide a couple of times before he was shot by his father
His father was a pastor apparently and shot him because his music was too secular kek
>When asked if he loved his son, Marvin Sr. reportedly stated in a soft voice, "Let's say I didn't dislike him."
that's fucked up man. glad i have a good relationship with my dad
>singing about sex and gyrating on stage
Sinful
>murder to prevent singing about sex
What God would have wanted
i'm still a bit conflicted about religion tbh.on one hand i don't want to seem like a smug fedora atheist but on the other hand the bible has messed up parts like when god sends some bears to kill children. also many of my favorite singers like elvis and stevie wonder sang religious songs so i feel a bit hypocritical listening to those while not being devout
I’m not religious but I do worship God (nature, life, being alive), the Bible is too convoluted to me and church folks are some of the biggest cooks in my life. Jesus Christ is alright with me though, I love Elvis Presley religious songs I don’t think it makes much of a difference if I’m a sinner going to Hell and enjoying them simultaneously.
yeah i think you're right. even as a non devout i think those songs stand up on their own just based off their quality
>but on the other hand the bible has messed up parts like when god sends some bears to kill children
Bad translation. In the original Hebrew they were teenage boys not literal children.
ah well. still even if the teens were being dickheads to the bald guy i don't think they deserved to get mauled
I could see why this did a lot to damage his reputation as a serious artist. It sounds like bad circus music.
?list=PL6law6Uk-M4EwGH12a_9_mDdClmcmB8Bm
Yeah this definitely sounds cheesy compared to his jazz crooner work, but to be fair a couple of bad albums hasn't soured people's opinions on other legends. People still love Elvis even if a lot of his work consisted on forgettable movie soundtracks
one time I saw a music documentary where they interview some boomer black DJ and he mentions the early '60s R&B scene and was like (in reference to Those Lazy Hazy Crazy Days of Summer) "That particular record wasn't one we were too fond of."
sinatra got in on the ground floor with dorsey and harry james in addition to being an actor which helped his popularity
nat was a pianist first and foremost who headed a pretty good trio and performed with buddy rich and lester young
that does not lend itself to popularity and as his sound became more sophisticated through the years he lost his original jazz audience
a shame that jazz fans are allergic to vocal jazz almost as much as swing
the other problem as I see it was that Nat began his recording career postwar when mainstream pop got a lot more dull and toothless compared to the big band era. therefore he tended to be lumped in with the Patti Page school of postwar dishwater pop.
does anyone have the clip of him performing on some tv show with a bunch of white girls in the audience giving him weird looks
Well, sinatra was an Italian mob boss who sang bossas and poetry, and nats jazz was when it was still brothel music, long before miles and monk
keep in mind that Nat had been performing with his band since the late 1930s when he was a kid although they didn't actually get a recording contract until after WWII. they only recorded that way for a few years and by 1949 were starting to move to big band/orchestra goop that a lot of jazz fans regarded as a sellout.
The last time he played piano very much on record was 1956's After Midnight. He rerecorded several 78 era tunes on modern hi fi stereo in 1961's The Nat King Cole Story. NKCT mostly predates tape recording so it's in direct to disc fuzz.
albums like Looking Back, Dear Lonely Hearts, Where Did Everybody Go?, and Lazy Hazy Days Of Summer are overburdened with gross 50s-60s orchestra cheese
He follows something of the same career arc as Dean Martin and Sinatra where the Capitol stuff is more brassy uptempo big band while the later Reprise recordings lean into a 60s MOR/pop country style. Dear Lonely Hearts is patterned after Ramblin' Rose, which is in no small part what Dean's later Reprise albums were patterned after. Those Lazy Hazy Crazy Days was a variation on that, with Sing Along With Mitch added in the pot. Looking Back was a comp (made after Nat's passing and with added overdubs) of some of Nat's R'n'R-lite singles, which were attempts to cross over a bit (think of some of Frank's more afield, for him, from the mid-60s)
Because hes ugly and less talented
>When Cole moved to Los Angeles after the war, he was the first black resident of Beverly Hills. He received a housewarming gift when the KKK burned a cross on his law.[3]
Lmao imagine what they'd think of current LA
To be honest not much because Hispanic gangs almost extirpated black 'hoods from LA.
Never knew the KKK supported Latinos
etika phenotype?
He was very talented but simply too square. He was to Sinatra as Mercer was to Crosby. A really good second place not to be scoffed at. His piano ability was incredible though.
Speaking of him and mercer this is one of my favorites
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