Medieval Hungary thread

Medieval Hungary was more interesting than France or England, yet this board seems to know little or nothing about it.

  1. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Well duh you can't find out about it from History Channel documentaries.

  2. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    It was definitely not

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      It 100% was. There’s a reason I didn’t include Spain, Germany or Italy and that’s because they might actually have an argument.

  3. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Keep in mind that in 600 years, Hungary was only conquered successfully by the Mongols under Batu Khan and they survived, England was conquered by Vikings and Normans in one century

  4. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >France
    Wasn't even a thing. France is a meme state created after the French Revolution, via the destruction and forceful assimilation of local cultures and history
    >England
    Medieval (and modern) English internal politics are like those Latin American soap operas. Everyone knows it's shit and forgettable, but it still has a loyal fanbase among the normies.
    England's foreign policy however, tends to be super interesting, shame whenever Bongs suffer some minor defeat they retreat to their island and isolate themselves for a century, or two

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >Wasn't even a thing. France is a meme state created after the French Revolution, via the destruction and forceful assimilation of local cultures and history
      First of all France as a state evidently existed, the argument you're trying to bastardise is about the French nation but as for that:
      Stop repeating dumbfuckery popular among French historiographers. Somehow this forceful assimilation worked well on Gascogne, but didn't work so well on Bretons or Elass-Lorraine Germans, but we'll just pretend that the French nation is a product of forced assimilation of perfectly distinct and separate identities that just happened to be administered by one government by sheer luck and its success or the lack of it has nothing to do with any kind of connections that may have been there beforehand.

  5. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >more interesting than England
    True
    >more interesting than France
    Nope

  6. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Based and reality pilled

  7. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Post some good (english language) sources about it then. I'd like to learn about it.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Pal Engel is the only one that matters

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        Is "The Realm of St Stephen: A History of Medieval Hungary, 895-1526" a good starting point?

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          Yes

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            Neat I'll give a download. If I like it I'll buy his book since it's not too expensive on Amazon.

            • 1 year ago
              Anonymous

              You won’t find anything more comprehensive in English.

              • 1 year ago
                Anonymous

                It certainly seems comprehensive given that date range and how big the book is. Honestly $30 on Amazon seems cheap for this.

              • 1 year ago
                Anonymous

                That’s a quarter of what I paid for it and it’s maybe my most treasured book

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        This is the only negative review for it. Is the translation terrible like he says or is it still enjoyable?

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          It'd have to be really bad for me to be put off. You'd be surprised how badly written some academic stuff is.

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            I'm all too aware of that. You'd like to think people who deal with books and papers all the time would pick up on good writing habits after a while.

            • 1 year ago
              Anonymous

              If you want good writing read Horthy’s autobiography if you want good history read Pal Engel.

              • 1 year ago
                Anonymous

                Seriously though if you want stories you haven’t heard of Franz Joseph then you should read Horthy’s autobiography.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          It’s not that bad, but it is very much academic. Probably a pop history fan like most Anglofrancoids.

  8. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Because Hungary isn't relevant in the modern day.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      They’re constantly in western news.

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        no they aren't and if they are its only to complain about their PM

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          >if they are
          Hungary is 100x more relevant than any of their neighbors including and especially Romania who are occupying half of Hungary.

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            100 x 0 is still 0

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            Right to self-determination is not occupation.

            • 1 year ago
              Anonymous

              Palestine has no right to exist. Good to know.

              • 1 year ago
                Anonymous

                The fuck are you talking about? What you're saying is more like Finland or Estonia doesn't have the right to exist, they should be part of Russia.

  9. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >OMG muh Hunyadi

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >muh bathory
      >muh zrinyi
      >muh janos pannonius
      >muh arpad and kurszan
      >muh st istvan
      >muh nagy lajos
      >muh the black army
      >muh bethlen gabor and the principality of erdely
      >muh two mongol invasions
      >muh kurucs
      >muh huszaria

  10. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    In the 14th century it was certainly up there in terms of power, being the top gold producer in Europe at the time, with export oriented economy and a strong army.

  11. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    How did it unravel so hard after Mattias Corvinus?

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Just baffling incompetence at Mohacs. A truly needless engagement compounded by reckless command of the army.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Just baffling incompetence at Mohacs. A truly needless engagement compounded by reckless command of the army.

      >Mohács
      FYI, Mohács was just the endgame. While it's true that Hungary was declining after Matthias' death, the scarier thing was how the Ottomans were gaining power faster than expected. It also didn't help how the Black Army rebelled and had to be put down.
      Everyone knew a catastrophe was at hand even before Mohács, since Hungary didn't receive military aid by the West. The mood among the nobles before the battle was pessimistic at best. We know this because there are plenty of letters, where nobles who got called into battle say their farewells to their family members and urge them to leave the country.
      The battle was a suicide mission, an all-or-nothing attempt. While it is honorable, how nobles didn't run away from the battle and certain death and this lived up to medieval knighthood, chivalry only gets you this far. The real catastrophe was how the country lost most of the leadership and intelligentsia, those who were needed the most in the future political turmoil.

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        The real catastrophe was the king dying without an heir, starting a civil war in Hungary. If that didn't happen Hungary probably could have gotten away with becoming an Ottoman tributary instead of getting partitioned.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          Which king are you talking about because this wasn’t something unprecedented in the Kingdom of Hungary? The difference as you touch on was the extermination of much of the nobility simultaneously.
          And I certainly wasn’t discounting the Ottomans in any way in my description of Mohacs if you’ll read those 2 posts I made again. We basically said the same thing regarding the Ottomans in fact.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          It got partitioned because the state collapsed and the translyvanian pretender cowardly allied himself with the ottomans than accept hapsburg dominion

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            >translyvanian pretender cowardly allied himself with the ottomans than accept hapsburg dominion
            Szapolyai was a bigger nagger than that
            >Ally with the Ottomans
            >Make a deal with the Habsburgs: they get Transylvania after his death if they recognize him as king
            >Habsburgs agree
            >Szapolyai has a bastard son
            >He goes back on his word
            >Turks make his snotty-nosed brat their puppet
            >Country divided into three parts
            Fuck this cocksucker. A Habsburg Hungary united with Transylvania would have been far better at holding its ground against the Ottomans than a country ripped into three

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        A Hungarian (Orban) was literally instrumental to the Ottomans conquering Constantinople, think about that.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          What's your point?

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          So fucking what, do you think we give a shit about the sob story of Byzantines?
          >A Hungarian mercenary bombed our walls, muh Orthoshit Christianity's holy city has fallen waah
          Who gives a fuck? Crusaders sacked Catholic cities and waged wars against the Byzantines too, not only the saracens. Venetians went full nagger, besieged Constantinople and turned it into a puppet kingdom, severely weakening it in the process. Byzantines had interfered in Hungarian internal politics 200 years earlier. Christian French attacked the Habsburgs, preventing them from liberating the Balkans from the Ottomans. 200 years later, Christian Bongs and French allied again with the Ottomans this time against the Russians.
          We don't give a damn about Constantinople. It was just another piece on the chessboard of Europe that got knocked down.

  12. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >On their way back home, the Hungarians accomplished a military performance, which was never even tried by a land army in the history. Having no ships, boats or any kind of watercraft, on 29 June 900,[36] they "embarked" on a sea campaign against Venice. As Chronicon Sagornini of John the Deacon writes that with their horses and "leather ships" to attack first the cities from the coast, then also the city of Venice itself.[35] The "leather ship" here refer to an animal skin (goat, sheep, maybe cow) tied up to form something like a huge bota bag, filled with air, tied on their horses sides, which helped the warrior and his horse to float, with which the Hungarians and the warriors of other nomadic societies usually used to cross rivers.[36] They first attacked and burned the coastal towns like Equilio, Cittanova, Fine, Capo d'Argine, then tying the filled animal skins to their horses, they crossed the waters of the Lagoon of Venice, and sacked the island town of Chioggia, which was a part of the Dogado (homeland of the Republic of Venice).[35] Then on the day of the martyrdom of Saint Peter and Saint Paul (29 June), on their "leather ships", they tried to enter Rialto and Malamocco, but before they reached the islands, on the place called Albiola the doge of Venice Pietro Tribuno met them with the Venetian war fleet, forcing them to retreat.[35] Although they lost this unusual sea battle, the Hungarians achieved something what was never done by a land army: attacking islands lying in the sea. And although the attack from 29 June was unsuccessful, they succeeded in the attack on the island of Chioggia. This attack was not a violation of the agreement with Berengar, because at that time Venice was not part of the Italian kingdom, but was an autonomous republic under Byzantine influence.[43]

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      If that isn’t the most chad shit I’ve ever heard god damn

  13. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >France
    Nah, France is quite interesting.
    >England
    The most overrated history of any nation.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >The most overrated history of any nation.
      How?

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        Because burgers are obsessed with it (since they're just feral englishmen)

  14. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    To this day I'm upset that neither Matias nor Hunyadi were able to keep shit together long enough for more decent campaigns against the Ottomans. They both proved they could win against them, and yet the fate of Hungary was never changed.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Two Romanians couldn't save a kingdom of hungypsies

  15. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >indobros...

  16. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    oh no no no

  17. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    How come so few Magyars changed tbe langauge of Hungary and left so many larpers? Battle of pressburg was cool btw

  18. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    only ones who could beat the HVNGARIANS was their cousins from mongolia?

  19. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >feudalism but not really, also WE ROMANS NOW
    >more interesting than development of absolutism and parliamentary democracy

  20. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >look up Hunyadi on wiki
    >It's full of citations that he was of "Romanian stock"
    >Suspiciously too much
    Sus?

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      AMOGUS

  21. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    No one cares about gypsies. Also they got annihilated by Turks

  22. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    I'll bite, in what is it more interesting?

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      As I mentioned, neither France nor England faced a threat like the Mongols or Ottomans. The Norman Conquest doesn’t even compare.
      The stakes were always much lower

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        And? Why would that make them more interesting?!

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          Why would it be more interesting than two countries that had to invent fictional characters like Arthur, Robin Hood or Joan just to cope?

          • 1 year ago
            Anonymous

            Joan existed

  23. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >this is what anglos perceive to be an existential threat
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Culloden

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >Did you hear about the thoughtful Scotsman who was heading out to the pub? He turned to his wee wife before leaving and said, ‘Jackie – put your hat and coat on lassie.’

      >She replied, ‘Awe Iain that’s nice – are you taking me to the pub with you?’

      >‘Nah, I’m just switching the central heating off while I’m out.’

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >Dougal was a typical Scot. His wife Janet had just died and he wanted to place the least expensive death notice. He went to the newspaper office and wrote on the lodgement from, “Janet died.”

      >The clerk explained that there was a minimum charge and he could have five words. Dougal added three more words: “Janet died, Toyota for sale.”

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >Alisdair Biggar, a Scotsman, applied to join the New York City police force.

      >The inspector glared at him and asked, ‘How would you disperse a large, unruly crowd?’

      >‘Well,’ replied Alisdair thoughtfully, ‘I’m no too sure how ye do it here in New York, but in Aberdeen we just pass the hat around, and they soon begin to shuffle off.’

  24. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Bump

  25. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Kingdom of Hungary was so Slavic that German chroniclers in the high medieval ages refered to it as a Slavic country and in middle of 18th century it was said in Diderot's Encyclopedia that "Magyar language was a Slavic dialect and therefore related to languages of Bohemia, Poland and Russia." In the year 1787 only 29% of Kingdom of Hungary were Magyars. All you need to know about Kingdom of Hungary but Magyars won't tell you that.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >Diderot's Encyclopedia
      https://quod.lib.umich.edu/d/did?type=simple&rgn=full+text&q1=magyar&cite1=&cite1restrict=author&cite2=&cite2restrict=author&Submit=Search
      impressive, it took 20 whole seconds to prove you are full of shit

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Meanwhile the Byzantines called Hungary "Turkia" and believed they were Turkic speakers. Neither Germans nor Greeks could get it right, they were clueless just like current westerners are clueless about Hungarian history

  26. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >some wild steppe churkas history
    >interesting
    Pick one.

  27. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Hungary: survived Mongol invasions

    England: conquered by pic related

  28. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Write your History in English if you want English speakers to know of it.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      Good point. I noticed Hungarian history is very lacking in English forms, the English wiki says very little, probably because very few Hungarians speak English and are interested in translating to English. But even Bulgarian history is much more available in English than Hungarian history, not sure why this is to be honest. Like King Geza II defeated a major Byzantine invasion of Hungary and there is no Wikipedia article of the battle

      • 1 year ago
        Anonymous

        From what I’ve gathered Hungarian histories are usually translated into German. Pal Engel himself is a German speaker.

        • 1 year ago
          Anonymous

          Also most of the primary sources are in Latin, not Magyar.

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