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Why does psychedelics makes people believe that there’s something more “out there”
Science and drugs general I guess. -
It doesn’t just make you "believe", dude, it actually expands your conscience so you’re starting to see what’s not there and, like, understand how things really work.
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This but unironically and /thread
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https://i.imgur.com/0IJpUlH.gif
Woke af. Too bad most entities won’t see past ego games and socially reinforced bias.
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Can you explain the ego games?
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Survival is diametrically opposed to truth. Reality is a field in which everything can be extracted from it. We are all fragments of God more or less subconsciously imagining itself outside of time and space, but God isn’t external to "what is". We are it. Nothingness is infinite potentialities, and awareness is self-realized within those dualities woke af on divine intuition.
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Lol I get it now
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Ealmost everyone I have ever met who’s done psycadellics parrots some derivation of this phrase
>except for my oldest sis when he told me about his DMT experience "I literally met god"
I had a good laugh with the lad over that -
>Be druggie
>Take LSD
>See weird patterns on walls
>Have a funny inner monologue
>Think you’re reborn or ascended
Do druggies really? That was your brain melting-
>be NPC
>have no idea what you’re talking about
>post anyway-
>be schizo
>take lsd
>become even a bigger schizo
>call other non-schizos NPCs for not being like you
You’re unironically cringe
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Wow really? You mean the drugs I took altered my brain? That changes everything.. I had no idea…
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You druggies are funny.
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bait
[…]
because of the dearth in consciousness research now (both behavioral and subjective consciousness) there isn’t really a "good" answer to this question.
one good idea that came out of some MRI scans on people undergoing a psych trip is the entropic brain hypothesis that relates to the "default mode network" brain activity structure that mediates consciousness.
in my layman’s understanding, these drugs redistribute the functioning of your DMN where they can reach the rest of your brain. it’s pretty much Huxley’s "reducing valve", but actual.
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Temporarily reverses the materialism-induced atrophy in your brain so you can see the obvious.
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Been thinking about this a lot. Also really curious about the similarities between doing things like DMT and people having near death experiences, been seeing some parallels. Namely,
>entity comes to pick them up to head into the next plane
>time no longer makes sense
>thoughts communicated telepathically and not through language
>meeting god(s)
>reflection on traumas-
>entity comes to pick them up to head into the next plane
Hallucination
>time no longer makes sense
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6543123/
Thoughts communicated telepathically and not through language
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thought_insertion#:~:text=Thought%20insertion%20is%20defined%20by,been%20inserted%20into%20one’s%20mind.&text=Thought%20insertion%20is%20a%20common,disorders%20and%20other%20medical%20conditions.
And
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thought_broadcasting
>meeting gods
See 1
>reflection on traumas
Random stuff comes up during hallucinations. Some may be related to emotional memories-
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>deboonker
>what is falsificationism
You know you can provide counterarguments instead of labelling, scrotebrain
Also
>schizo explaining his schizo symptoms
>medical expert explains what delusions are
>schizo calls him deboonker and laughs at him with his spirit guides
Back to LULZ with you-
>what is falsificationism
A self-refuting ideology.
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Bump
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My experience is that psychedelics remove barriers in your brain and cause you to "realize" things that may or may not be true. It does seem incredibly obvious at the time but then when you sober up and think about it rationally, you can’t quite convince yourself.
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>literal NPCs
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No anon, you are the NPC. Psychadelics make you feel like you’re having some mindbending lifechanging spiritual experience, but then it turns out you’re just bonked up on drugs and going "dude.. it’s like all connected.. I’ve figured it out.. woah..". If you can’t look back with hindsight and see that, and instead think it was a real spiritual experience despite changing nothing about your life and being totally unexplainable, it’s because you’re totally incapable of introspection
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>Psychadelics make you feel like you’re having some mindbending lifechanging spiritual experience, but then it turns out you’re just bonked up on drugs and going "dude.. it’s like all connected
Why are you projecting your vacuous experiences onto others? -
this is a totally valid point and a lot of druggies don’t realize psychedelics can be fallible they will completely mislead you at times however if i had a journal of all my thoughts when i was high on acid or weed or bath salts i think i’d be a more wiser man day to day. i’ve had some extremely profound realizations, mostly ways of thinking i guess, but they are all lost like the last thoughts you have at the end of the day before falling asleep
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>this is a totally valid point
It’s a point that only applies to people like you, though, and everyone agrees that NPCs shouldn’t take psychedelics.
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>e but then when you sober up and think about it rationally, you can’t quite convince yourself.
This was my experience, drugs are dangerous for that makes you feel like you have all the answers in that moment.-
You might have, but didn’t have the understanding of what you were experiencing to rationally understand it. This is especially true with LSD which bombards your brain with abstraction.
It’s like if you saw Einstein’s equations for relativity, if you had no understanding of complex math it’d be mostly gibberish to you. This is what happens with teens who are the most common users of acid. That’s why acid users can’t seem to verbalize their ideas or seem crazy if they do.
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>That’s why acid users can’t seem to verbalize their ideas or seem crazy if they do.
All the acid users I know verbalize their ideas better than you do yours.
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I think its called schizophrenia, seeing connections where there are none. Connections obviously have their gradation, if you think about it everything is connected, at the very least by the history of the universe. That being said the realizations you have while under the influence are too fat reaching, its like lenin made up communism on weed thinking it will be utopia.
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You know when you dream and you think everything that’s happening, no matter how absurd it is, is totally real ?
I think it’s a similar thing, you lose your ability to critically think about what you’re experiencing so if you see or feel a weird entity or you’re exploring another world it’s simply the real thing.
If you’re inclined to the paranormal you just keep believing in it even when not on drugs because it felt so real. -
it is literally an emotional disorder related an inability to perceive & experience wonder
people are using harsh chemicals in order to produce a childlike sense of wonder
there are milder ways of doing this, but drugs are going to work for some people
in fact, most people will be better off experimenting with walking & solitude & breathing
if you can mentally shut off guilt & embarrassment feelings using tricks that may help-
>if you can mentally shut off guilt & embarrassment feelings using tricks that may help
Care to elaborate anon? -
kys scrotebrain if you cannot find true beauty by just taking a walk in nature and seeing how much bigger and wondrous life and reality is then you’re the npc
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>literal NPC continues to misunderstand
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>can see sounds and smell abstract ideas on shrooms
>when they are at 10% intensity (before things become inexpressible)
>dude just take a walk for the same kind of thing
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Because it makes you feel ineffable things. Try to describe the color green to someone who is blind from birth. You’ll find it to be utterly impossible.
Similarly, people who take psychedelics experience something far more profound that is just as ineffable.
Now, there is no reason to think what they experienced is representative of "true reality", BUT the mere fact that a human brain is capable of having such experiences is enough to be impressed and sent down a philosophical rabbit hole
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on the one hand i find it interesting what kind of effects these drugs have on the brain but on the other i have the strange suspicion that in the future psychedelics are going to be used to essentially control the population by therapists and universities so on. you would think that this type of "liberating" drug would have the opposite effect but so far the biggest push for legalization is for mental disorder/PTSD treatment. and the state of the brain in a drugged condition is extremely malleable. it will be used to condition people to be content with current modes of life wherein they would otherwise become catatonic. is this unreasonable to believe?
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>it will be used to condition people to be content with current modes of life wherein they would otherwise become catatonic
>is this unreasonable to believe?
What you’re suggesting is perfectly in line with the methods and aims of the mental health industry, however, the types of suggestions that psychedelics make the mind most amenable to, are out of line with cynical materialism.
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As a ex-abuser and STEM scrote, I personally think that the brain has some kind of pattern and data stored since birth which relates to experiencing reality. Due to the effects of the drugs these built in patters get shaken up, they receive weird info and connect to places they were not quite meant to connect to leaving to changed pathways.
People who experience this tend to think this is opening their third eye and shit. I think its most comparable to the difference between how you processed reality as a child and how you process it now. Not that they mature you or something, just that the feeling has some similarities, but much more rapid -
If drugs can change my perception of reality, then how the fuck do we know if what we normally perceive as reality is really reality? Our brain is still operating off of chemicals either way.
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They do not change your perception of reality, idiot. Everything is the same, you’re just hallucinating.
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There is a surface of all possible experience. Your experience is delineated by a circle on that surface. Most people think their circle is all of reality. Psychedelics create a break in the edge of the circle that forces you to reconcile that there is a universe outside your perceptual circle. That’s my experience anyways.
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Well think about it… The strongest psychedelic which often changes people’s view on reality is almost entirely non-visual (bufo alvarius venom)… So firstly I would disregard visual aspects, it is clearly the alteration in headspace that is doing what you say.
Now, a drug in itself cannot think. And this is important because it also has to be realized firstly that the "drug" is not itself thinking certain thought patterns, the mind is. The reason that’s important is that it is then of course hypothetically plausible that these exact same states are possible to achieve sober, and are just another element of your mind which exists whether you take drugs or not, or ever experience such a thing or not.
Because the alteration that matters is in headspace, is subjective, and not actually "thought up" by the drug but rather the mind, it’s not possible to say which view of reality is accurate.
If nothing about consensus reality changes at all, and no element of science changes at all, just a philosophical position, it can’t then be said that it is in any less valid.
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Did you just cure me of addiction? Amazing under rated insight thanks anon
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All the answers above are bullshit. The specific effect you’re describing is "novelty enhancement". Psychedelics dial up the feeling of novelty in the same way that a drug can dial up the intensity of any other mental processes like pleasure, fear, paranoia, love, etc. The feeling of something being novel is not something we normally think of as being affected by our mental state, but rather as an attribute of whatever it is we find interesting or not. Try writing down anything you think it’s profound while high and 9/10 when you’re sober it’ll be the most mundane crap. Psychedelics have been a midwit trap any time after the 70s.
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You’ve never had a serious trip probably… You don’t know what your mind is capable of… The level of fear and panic on a bad 5-MeO-DMT trip is worse than literal death. I feel that when I die for real, it will be less frightening than the ordeals I have been through on DMT. It is not just the same shit but "novel" at all… One trip with 5-MeO and you will understand the entirety of the Upinashads. This shit does not occur to people naturally.
I’m a logical person. There is something to these compounds. They aren’t transporting you to other realms but they start killing off certain brain processes which have evolved over millions of years to funnel you into strict beliefs that benefit your survival… Theoretically there’s no limit we could ever discern in the field of mind, ours is limited by brain structure. But the possibilities of what could be experienced by mind given another structure in general is unfathomable…
Think of Darwinian evolution, think about the arbitrary nature of qualia (why should the way the external world appears only be understood by sight?), think about what traits are passed down through all these years… It is anti-survival to not have a sense of self and other, that is why ego death in particular is so profound as it is probably the most fundamental element evolved into the mind of any living creature.
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>than the ordeals I have been through on DMT
post some trip stories fren
t. too scared to do anything other than the occasional weed
>One trip with 5-MeO and you will understand the entirety of the Upinashads.
quoi?-
I did have a life changing mystical trip with DMT but I was also peaking on 5 hits of acid at the same time.
But the last one gave me PTSD for a short while. It’s because I kept smoking it trying to force a breakthrough. You do build tolerance, it doesn’t last long, I think 2 hours? Well I ended up dumping a very, very big amount into the vaping cup thing.
Smoked it and went into legit psychosis. A little pig man was raping me. It was my own body but I interpreted it this way and it was trying to hump up onto me. I lost all control of my body and started stroking my cock against my will which now looked like a little piglet or pig snout. It then became very similar to a Salvia trip, and I kept flipping over and over. I started yelling at this point and literally falling and writhing around the floor convinced I had broken the universe, strong sense of motion. If you’ve used Salvia extract you know what I mean, but it was more intense than that. Flatmates came running. I was throwing drool up the wall. I was completely insane.
I would say 95% of DMT trips are completely meaningless junk and higher doses usually result in chaotic speedy random visual madness. It is Bufo which reliably induces extreme mystical experience. Almost zero visuals. Just headspace shift.
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I’m my last trip I was dragged into a torture room by demons and broken down until I lost all sense of who I was. I was essentially reduced to a cornered animal. The demons told me even when the trip was over that I was still under their control and for a year afterwards every time I even got slightly upset I flashed back to them telling me I was still under their control. I don’t underestimate the impact they can have on our fragile brains, but it doesn’t take any profound philosophical insights to do so. Just a $5 wrench to the psyche.
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i met a blue goddess who told me because i never waivered my belief in god regardless of what the world wanted me to believe, that she loved me dearly.
but yeah i agree its all just psyuchological shit. prob gave me what i wanted to here. honestly one of the most amazing experiences ever though, but that’s all it was i guess. an experience but not meaningful. not like i full on believe in god like going to church n stuff, more just like "a greater good that exists". i didnt even know it implied god in my psyche
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Those aren’t demons anon, they’re projections of your imagination.
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Atheists who use psychedelics don’t have spiritual experiences on them, and don’t report having changed from being atheists as a result of their experiences on psychedelics.
If you harbor some magical thinking– if you sometimes wish upon a star, or throw pennies into fountains, or say a little prayer and buy a lottery ticket, then you might encounter spirits and have mystical adventures in psychedelics. But if all of that is nonsense that just doesn’t routinely occur to you at all, then you’ll have an interesting time thinking thoughts and maybe experiencing different kinds of hallucinations. But it won’t be much different from watching a really impactful and fascinating, though disjointed and plotless movie in your head.-
checked
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>Atheists who use psychedelics don’t have spiritual experiences on them
Utterly false, unless we’re talking about your brand of cattle-brained nu-atheism, which results from some kind of brain atrophy.
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Fucks with your pattern recognition, leading to new perceived patterns, or patterns that didn’t exist within the initial paradigm.
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*couldn’t exist
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I was watching The Incredibles 2 while tripping on LSD and it was freaking crazy. It felt like there was no difference between me and the characters, and every emotion they felt was my emotion. If psychedelics ever become legal I have a business idea to create a psychedelic movie theater
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That’s awesome haha. If you had enough starting capital, you could probably start testing the idea in small ways in Oregon. Tightly regulate how much each person is given, as a show of integrity. Might have to worry about fed raids tho.
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I was put on ketamine twice while in the hospital. Everything that happens to you seems and feels real, even more real than real (like 4k picture looks better than reality). And then there is intuitive knowledge that just appears in your head, you know things, but not in the same way as you know that sky is blue, for example.
So it makes very easy to believe in things for those who already want to believe and look for this shit in their lives. To me it was just a fun experience while also being a huge pain relief.-
Interesting. I wish you can elaborate on this part
>And then there is intuitive knowledge that just appears in your head, you know things, but not in the same way as you know that sky is blue, for example.
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because the experiences you make transcend and break all categories that your mind had built up through the course of your life.***
*** given that you take a lot (in my case 6g of cubensis)
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try and find out.
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>humans crave meaning
>take substance that connects a bunch of parts of your brains
>experience emotions that don’t even really have terms
>see that the line between reality and hallucinations is mostly arbitrary
>can help reset your brain to a fresh state
you get what can be considered a religious experience and your brains in a fresher/looser/more openminded state – how else would you expect people to rationalize it? -
It makes you question scientific realism since what you observe with a sober mind is still just in your head. What a sober healthy mind can observe is curated by evolution. We can only observe things that were relevant to the survival of the species.
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Yeah exactly. People lol at insights like this because they associate it with pot or random acid trips. People who discuss nonduality who were brought to it by experience and not choice, have done HARD psychedelics like bufo or DMT in big doses.
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What happened to the Nootropics? Was there simply nothing to those drugs? Just another 90s fad that came and went?
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They were "drugs" for people too scared to use drugs. AKA homeopathy and placebo tier BS…
Phenibut works but is an actual drug essentially, and can cause fatal withdrawals like benzos and alcohol. Acts similar to those substances and GHB.
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https://i.imgur.com/ky5asHV.gif
Types of people who participate in these discussions:
>people who dismiss psychedelics because they have some emotional hangups wrt. drug usage
>people who took 2 grams of shrooms that one time, and think they understand what the experience is all about
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts have taught them something about reality
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts refute the psychedelic experience
I guess it’s just not for everyone…-
https://i.imgur.com/eGS4KpR.gif
woke af frog licker
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What else is there? What are YOUR thoughts in the subject?
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Not that anon, but I grew up in a household where religion/spirituality/whatever wasn’t ever emphasized if barely spoken about at all.
Balls deep in a psychology degree and hoping to become a clinical psych. I took DMT under a controlled environment where there was a Peruvian ‘shaman'(?) overlooking it.Anyway, I uh, don’t know what to tell you anon but after that experience.. fuck man it’s really hard to not be able to express these things in this field or STEM fields – because I tried to onetime, and holy fuck, the absolutely dogmatic attitudes I began perceive, like science was a religion in itself. Now I’m stuck in the middle of thinking both mainstream and organized religion is dumb shit and the "if science can’t prove it then it’s pseudoscience" approach is just as scrotebrained.
It turns out, people care less about knowledge and understanding truth then they care about social status, filling a role, fitting in, and adhering to the status quo just so they aren’t outsiders. Now I’m looking back on my life, wondering what the fuck have I missed because I also applied this approach for sometime, albeit unconsciously or subconsciously I suppose.
If you’re going to DMT or any psychedelic substance with the impression "haha i cant wait to see how bullshit it is" or some kind of smart aleck atittude – prepare your freaking anus because that’s exactly what I did and WHATEVER it was that I "met" during the trip, gave me the freaking lecture of a lifetime.. and that’s an understatement.
Things are far more complicated then breaking shit down into fractions and theoritical approach anon.. The TruF iS oUt TheRe AnoN
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This post is peak mid wit. Seriously you can’t even argue your first point let alone make a sequitur.
Am I to believe you’re above the age of 18 and have had an existential crisis before?
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I don’t give a shit what you believe lol
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Great to see you have a nice developed world view whilst blasting others for not having one!
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Akchtually if you scroll up a little bit, and see the post I was responding to, the question was
>What are YOUR thoughts in the subject?if my THOUGHTS offended you, then maybe you shouldn’t be in whatever the fuck it is that you do in science, because you’re not gonna make it.
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It’s more that your THOUGHTS are completely hollow and vapid and you’re so devoid of thinking skills you completely missed the question which was about perceived participants in these discussion, with
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts have taught them something about reality
being you.-
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts have taught them something about reality
being you.
Yep, I was talking about him there, but notice how you’re far more excited to engage with him, than you are with my response to your question.-
I’m not offended by your thoughts but more the lack thereof.
Feel free to believe in the unpsecified dogmatic attitudes you, and no one else can see. But when you do make sure the board is >>>LULZ and not[…]
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How about learning to perceive who is behind what post before acting like you’re hot shit.
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>I’m not offended by your thoughts
Where did I say you’re offended by my thoughts? -
>if my THOUGHTS offended you
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https://i.imgur.com/KkiuFVb.gif
That’s not my post, though.
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>s-sure showed everyone how much spiritually superior i am to her fufun
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>Great to see you have a nice developed world view whilst blasting others for not having one!
Maybe take your own advice
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I haven’t made any world view in this thread nor have I said you’d need one.
Are you an ESL or just lacking in the head compartment?
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>If you’re going to DMT or any psychedelic substance with the impression "haha i cant wait to see how bullshit it is"
The scientific dogmas around this are incredibly foolish. There are infinite numbers of physical realms, civilizations and universes, we can be incarnated in many horrific experiences if we keep deluding ourselves within the optimization of survival for restricted belief systems and lifeforms. The point of survival is always more survival, but this doesn’t go anywhere nor is it the end goal of existence at all. Science is not bad, since it helps us having some not too random baseline of dream where we can make sense of reality, but it’s only useful up to the point it backfires in attachments. -
>fuck man it’s really hard to not be able to express these things in this field or STEM fields – because I tried to onetime, and holy fuck, the absolutely dogmatic attitudes I began perceive, like science was a religion in itself. Now I’m stuck in the middle of thinking both mainstream and organized religion is dumb shit and the "if science can’t prove it then it’s pseudoscience" approach is just as scrotebrained.
Explain what you mean. So you tried to talk about some spiritual experience in a STEM-field and didn’t like peoples reaction or what? I hope you aren’t disappointed if people don’t take everything you experienced on a drug trip as fact anon, that’s more of a problem with your own attitude.-
Not so much my experience, more so the actual inquiry of
>"What if it’s more then just hallucinations?"You’ll get shut down quite quickly before you can even present a hypothesis.
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Yeah because that argument has already been made a thousand times only this time you’re actually under the influence of something.
Feel free to think you’ve found some secret gateway to reality but we have a board for that >>>/x/. Come back to LULZ when you start accepting some basic fundementals about reality.
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The question of
>"What if there is more to hallucinations?"
has been argued over a thousand times?You don’t even know my argument, and the fact is that some people who experience them sometimes have such profound effects (whether negative or positive) that it can either improve/benefit or deteriorate someone’s life forever.
Also, pic related
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Yes we get it. You took hallucinogens and are susceptible to psychosis, now please make your argument in an LULZ post because this isn’t science.
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Calling me a schizo because you don’t want to respond to my posts isn’t science anon, maybe you should post in LULZ.
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but anon, what you posted are literally just LULZ infographics
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>doesn’t register the concept that image provides
>calls poster schizo
so kind of like when religious nuts don’t understand science, is that what you’re doing anon? yeesh-
Doesn’t register with me, either. Is it supposed to demonstrate anything more than the fact that pop-sci figures aren’t really promulgating science?
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>these are good until they shit on aspects of my own cancerous world view
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bold assumption anon I’m very much a race realist but the issue becomes forcing your beliefs half heartedly into something that starts off scientific, low quality half baked ideas in the second half hurt the first half there are much better arguments to be made about superiority of certain races or even that race may effect the quality of ones soul or spiritual side. Differences between races need to be acknowledged but the /poo/ tier shit does more to hurt that reality than help it.
>everyone who doesn’t blindly follow something must believe the exact opposite thing
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I dunno why the anti-Semitic tropes are prevalent in this pic but I’m mostly posting it for the rest of the information.
Your definition of science is flimsy because it’s constantly evolving. Meditation was also psuedoscience until we attached freaking nodes on the heads of those that practice it, and varying degrees of brain activity + density of gray matter increase was proven correct.
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>Your definition of science
Have yet to give one anon. Please find help because you seem to be in a psychosis right now.-
>now please make your argument in an LULZ post because this isn’t science.
Actually, you have a definition considering that whatever I presented wasn’t fit for your criteria. So while you haven’t implied what SCIENCE is, you’ve given what it isn’t. Therefore you have a definition of it. If what I have is apsychosis, at least it insinuates I have brain activity.. I’d rather that then whatever thick custard like substance it is, that you’re using to muster up an argument.
Now the next question is, who is really the scrotebrained one here? You? Or me arguing with custard.
I take my leave, Mr. dense yellow slop.
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>you’ve given what it isn’t. Therefore you have a definition of it
Are all of you actually scrotebrained? -
If you define something by the attributes it doesn’t have, then you’re automatically implying the attributes it does.. otherwise you couldn’t argue what it isn’t.
This is basic reasoning skills, the fuck is wrong with you?
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>If you define something by the attributes it doesn’t have
He didn’t do that, either, though. -
>now please make your argument in an LULZ post because this isn’t science.
It’s right there. He defined what my argument by what it wasn’t. So, uh yeah, you’re wrong I guess.
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what my argument *was.
Are typos LULZ related content only guys? I’m not sure what the definition of science is, but I know what it isn’t thanks to you guys.
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>He defined what my argument by what it wasn’t.
Defined being your post and not the definition of science. -
If you use your navigation skills to a basic level of reading and/or comprehension you will see the unfolding discussion presented thusly
>I present argument
>Says argument isn’t scientific
>Address his comment, stating that his definition of science is subject to change
>Anon responds by saying he has yet to define what science is
>Proceed to ask anon what it is, since he is able to distinguish what it isn’t.
>Calls me scrotebrainedNo.. what I was describing was called "a priori" as in, we know that all bachelors are unmarried because that is how you use the word BACHELOR.
What you are doing is, asking me a question that is aimed at fulfilling your agenda, not for a truth. Which is called a loaded question.
Here are some links you may find useful!
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Here’s an illustration, anon.
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Why are you seething? I just drew you a nice little picture explaining how you can tell what something is not, without telling what it is.
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That’s not a comprehensive list of all the things science is not, anon.
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>If you define something by the attributes it doesn’t have, then you’re automatically implying the attributes it does..
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>See pic related here
You’ve yet to make a central point. -
>If you define something by the attributes it doesn’t have, then you’re automatically implying the attributes it does
A banana isn’t a square…. Therefore it’s automatically a circle? -
Can you read?
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>he doesn’t understand even with concrete examples
Let him be. It’s hopeless. -
Yeah which is why I showed you’re scrotebrained.
>>I present argument
This never happened.
>>Says argument isn’t scientific
Nor did this happened.
>>Address his comment, stating that his definition of science is subject to change
Self-fulfilling prophecy
>>Proceed to ask anon what it is,
Never happened:
> what I was describing was called "a priori" as in, we know that all bachelors are unmarried because that is how you use the word BACHELOR.
That’s not a priori thats a tautology.
Besides the point; you cannot infer someone’s definiton because one property doesn’t comply. -
lmao what?
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If a banana isn’t a square
then it means a square isn’t a banana.What the fuck does a circle have to do with this?
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>If a banana isn’t a square
>then it means a square isn’t a banana.
You think being banal is worth something? -
@urselfawerness
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Forgot pic. Sorry was having psychosis and forgot to upload it.
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>Meditation was also psuedoscience until we attached freaking nodes on the heads of those that practice it, and varying degrees of brain activity + density of gray matter increase was proven correct.
Yes, and people beeing able to levitate or jump dimensions or beeing able to shoot fireballs out of their anus wasn’t proven correct. It’s just the very boring "working out your brain with specific exercises can have some cognitive benefits", wow. I bet very little people would have objected to that notion even back when mediation was studied less in the past.
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Please do not mix spirituality with anti-semitic and racist garbage.
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[…]
Your definition of science is flimsy because it’s constantly evolving. Meditation was also psuedoscience until we attached freaking nodes on the heads of those that practice it, and varying degrees of brain activity + density of gray matter increase was proven correct.This is what happens when a white supremacists open their third eye lol. I did enjoy reading it though. Pretty awesome.
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>people shut me down before i can even explain how the machine elves are actually interdimensional beings
I’m afraid selling that one to the science-mag-reading public is a tall order for a little guy like you, anon. Only Terence McKenna can get away with that.
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What you make of what you see, is a function of what you understand. If you take too much — you see too much, and there’s nothing useful to make out of it. Somewhere between banality and delusion, there’s a space worth exploring; you will pass through it repeatedly as you swing back and forth, and you need to learn to recognize that space, so you could slow down a little and turn on your mental dictaphone. If you do it right, you will end up with experiences amenable to sober reflection, you will end up with new connections, you will end up with inspiration, you will end up with new avenues for artistic or intellectual exploration; if you let it all cook properly, you may end up with new understanding, so that you could make more of what you see next time. I also think the path from experiencing something that you don’t understand, to understanding an experience at face value, passes through intermediate understanding via metaphors and symbolism; that is to say, you shouldn’t dismiss outlandish experiences as meaningless, but you shouldn’t take them at face value, either, until you understand them.
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100 posts later, still holds.
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You’re smug scrote with 0 answers.
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Look at this thread and tell me I’m wrong. What do you need answered, anyway?
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>Why does psychedelics makes people believe that there’s something more “out there”
>Science and drugs general I guess.
Psychosis. This only happens to people susceptible to that. -
Taking hallucinogenics changes braun activity similar to those observed in psychosis. A lot of the symptoms can be summarized in inabilities to properly attribute the causes of cognitions and sensations. E.g., one’s thoughts are belueved to come from outside, maybe feelings are induced by others. A disturbed cause effect perceptopn may also lead to the perception that others read one’s mind, or their random behavior is in some way relevant to oneself or one’s thoughts. This allows for all kinds of strange interpretations of world events: synchronicities, energy (feeling energy/aura is a misattribution of bodily sensations eg induced by stress), paranoia and other manias like relationship mania, etc.
It gets worse when activity in higher perceptual areas (imagination) spill over to primary areas (perception) which leads to hallucinations. Now, not only is the ability to accurately interpret perceived events broken, but also perception itself.-
Source? Most antipsychotic drugs work primarily by inhibiting dopaminergic pathways, whilst classical psychedelics work via a serotonergic mechanism. The "drug induced psychosis" is not typically the psychosis of a mental disorder w/r/t psychedelics, while stimulant psychoses exhibit extremely similar pathologies to "typical" psychotic episodes because their action mechanisms are also dopaminergic.
There is a serotonergic component to antipsychotics as well, which is why you can use drugs like risperdal or quetiapine to kill trips, because they have an inverse agonist or antagonistic mechanism for the 5-HT receptors that psychedelics work on, that exists alongside the dopaminergic mechanism.
In addition, the rise of first-occurring psychotic episodes related to drug use seem to be congruent with the idea of a stressful event being trigger for a latent mental illness, rather than a mechanism by the drug itself. This is supported by a recent survey in what I think was Denmark, that showed no significant correlation between drug use and mental illness, implying that drug use only exacerbates rather than causes mental illness.
I’m pretty certain that there are also reports about "real" or non-drug-related psychoses being qualitatively different from typical psychoses. Schizophrenics don’t usually rave on about pretty colors and shapes, only voices in their head, which afaik isn’t typical of a psychedelic experience.
It just seems indeterminate at best right now whether or not drug use can actually "cause" mental illness. I’ll grant it can turn you into a freaking nutcase though, given all of the intelligent people that take psychedelics and start to believe the hallucinations too much, but I have some trouble characterizing this as a typical "mental illness".
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>narcissistic scrotes ruin yet another thread
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Druggies are freaking scrotebrained.
They mistake hallucinations for a profound experience that lets them better understand the nature of reality
How?
Do drugs magically make you develop new sensory organs? No, it just changes how your brain interprets what already exists.
So there is literally nothing drugs let you perceive about reality that you wouldn’t already be able to perceive while sober. The only rational explanation is that the change occurs in your brain.
Drugscrotes are the equivalent of a primitive who thinks cameras steal your soul having an existential freak out over a photoshop.-
See:
https://i.imgur.com/ky5asHV.gif
Types of people who participate in these discussions:
>people who dismiss psychedelics because they have some emotional hangups wrt. drug usage
>people who took 2 grams of shrooms that one time, and think they understand what the experience is all about
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts have taught them something about reality
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts refute the psychedelic experience
I guess it’s just not for everyone…-
Using drugs for inspiration by taking advantage of the brain wiring being shifted =/= the brain being a magical transceiver that is malfunctioning until mundane earth-plants are consumed.
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>I understood nothing
Fair enough. Reflect on it if you ever do happen to consume "mundane earth plants".-
>if you don’t agree with me it’s because you don’t understand!
Childish as fuck.-
You can’t understand until you have some direct experience, anon.
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pretty much this
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I did psychedelics a couple of times ranging from moderate to high doses, but never had a spiritual experience. But I also never had a guide or something.
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What do you expect a "spiritual experience" to be like?
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Feeling connected, maybe a feeling of oneness, the presence of some entity, some god or something. Have the feeling of gaining some understanding of something about reality, the mystical, life and all that.
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What’s the closest you ever got to any of it?
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I looked at some plants in a park and had a feeling they had a kind of presence or personality. But that was mostly it and it’s nothing that affected me much once I got sober again.
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They do have a kind of presence and personality, don’t they? They’re nice to be around, even if you aren’t high. I don’t know why your trips have been limited to that. For what it’s worth, the thing that put me on the path was to notice how subtly playful reality is when you pay attention to what goes on around you: it’s a constant stream of little ironies and coincidences, with certain repeating themes and motifs, and once you catch on and go along with it, you get rewarded with even more incredulous stuff, until you get a certain sense of how things are woven together. It sticks with you; you sober up, and you can shrug everything off as a bunch of cute synchronicities, and still, you’re not so sure reality is a bunch of dead matter.
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>y-you have to experience it maaaaan
Yeah trust the brain you deliberately impaired to give you an accurate perception.
Millions of independent verified perceptions >>>> [POWER GAP] > My personal experiences > Your experiencesStrange druggies never manage to perceive the same thing.
So they come up with the "infinite layers realities" cope to explain why despite insisting they experienced a deeper level of reality none of the data they provide matches up.-
Yes they all ultimately perceive the exact same thing figures like the Buddha perceived while sober. That is why "we’re all one mannn" is a meme. Because ultimately all psychedelics lead to ego death and collapse of duality.
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>this again
See:https://i.imgur.com/ky5asHV.gif
Types of people who participate in these discussions:
>people who dismiss psychedelics because they have some emotional hangups wrt. drug usage
>people who took 2 grams of shrooms that one time, and think they understand what the experience is all about
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts have taught them something about reality
>people who took more than they should have, and think the resulting delusions and brainfarts refute the psychedelic experience
I guess it’s just not for everyone…-
Explain the mechanics of how consuming drugs gives you a better understanding of metaphysics or the fundamental nature of reality.
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You become a lot more receptive.
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stupid.
how do you become more perceptive?
All your sensory organs are the same, the only thing that changed is your brain. -
>All your sensory organs are the same, the only thing that changed is your brain.
Yes. You become more receptive. -
Cope Chud.
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Dude you dont understand. When I take these Gifts the archon’s veil is lifted from our eyes and the world appears in its true form that we can finaly sense with the senses, but fail to comprehend fully.
I can only tell you to try it before passing judgement. Don’t let pawns tell you otherwise, there’s a whole, true, world to explore and these harmless pharmacons will guide us there. -
>t. butthurt NPC
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when you’re exhausted and have brain fog, are you very perceptive?
when you’re wired on caffeine and sugars, are you very perceptive?
when you’re merging with the universe on psilocybin, well, you really have to experience it to understand
perhaps look up the definition of perceptive -
…yet if someone said doing shrooms let them see in ultraviolent or infrared, they’d be called scrotebrained and brain damaged for thinking so.
Yet you’re trying to convince people that you can perceive something orders of magnitude more complex that we don’t even have sensory organs for by consuming flora.
Makes perfect sense.
Your scrotebraination is why boomers support the war on drugs.
Why can’t you just say it’s something fun and novel like a lucid dream or something? -
>b-b-b-but how can you be more perceptive if you don’t even see infra red or hear infra sound or anything??
Are these real people? -
>I can perceive layers of reality that all of the efforts of science are unable to
>But nothing that humans can’t but would require a tool
your position relies on the same faulty reasoning and willful ignorance as LITERAL CULTS lmfao -
>NPC can’t understand the difference between raw sense data and perception
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ironic coming from the dude advocating freaking their brain up then can’t tell the difference between perception and reality.
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I’m not advocating for anything. I just find it remarkable how NPCs can’t comprehend the basics of being conscious.
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Science doesn’t perceive things my guy
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>p-please take my delusions seriously!
>science doesn’t perceive things, gotcha! I’m going to pretend to be scrotebrained so I don’t have to address your point. -
I did address your point, science doesn’t perceive things. Everything you perceive is something science is unable to perceive.
Imagine not taking drugs and believing science is something capable of perception.
Halfwits these days, jesus freaking christ.
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>doubling down on "science perceives things" strawman
Drugs really do cause permanent brain damage -
Not a strawman, here it is in your own scrotebrained words
>I can perceive layers of reality that all of the efforts of science are unable to -
Grasp at straws harder lol
Still haven’t explained how consooming plant allows people to perceive things that can’t be measured or detected despite all organized efforts of humanity trying to understand how the universe works. -
>the NPC still can’t grasp the difference between perception and measurement
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>muh qualia
cope -
>the nonhuman is seething about qualia again
Qualia is only tangentially related, so I’m not sure why you’re seething about it. -
>anyone who disagrees with me is an npc >:^(
For all that talk about perception you’ve shown a critical lack of understanding about it -
It’s not my fault that you are a literal nonhuman piece of meat who doesn’t understand how perception can be enhanced with the same amount of sense data coming in.
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>to perceive things that can’t be measured or detected
A.) That’s how perception works brainlett
B.) You are the one who decided people who trip claim to be able to percieve what can’t be detected. -
Yikes, dude. Imagine taking illegal drugs and thinking you know more than the experts. We need to unpack this.
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>habitual users of narcotics think they know more about the nature of reality than the people literally putting in billions of man hours of effort in learning
This is why people don’t like drug addicts.
You’re the equivalent of a liberal arts feminist who thinks she’s knows more about how civilization functions than every single tradesman and laborer combined. -
Um, sweaty? I’m on your side. I think these druggie incels need to trust the experts and stop using illegal substances.
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there was not one expertly thing said in this thread except maybe
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Listen, my guy, scientific experts have established that illegal drugs make you schizophrenic.
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source? Im sure you’re misinterpreting things
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we all live within our own psychological prisons, for better or worse. psychedelics, when used responsibly for the purposes of self-improvement or therapy, categorically allow the user to detach them"selves" from mental constructs and hard-wired beliefs which often results in deeply meaningful "enlightenment"-like experiences, re-orientating their worldview. psilocybin WILL be used to treat major depressive/PTSD patients in the future
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Meditation is the process of shutting off the brain so you become more perceptive of the unseen world
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Because you silly goose, your brain when sober alters your perception as is fit for survival and replication, it’s purposefully not giving you an accurate picture, because if it did, you would probably die.
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Do you know this from experience?
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I do. Ego is a construct of the brain as an example. If a simple creature can’t distinguish itself from other, well… It’s pretty obvious what survival implications that has.
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Are you awakened and what does it feel like?
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Well I had several existential crises over a period of a year and a half, and now I just feel like a normal human again.
People who take drugs already know they are taking drugs which alter their brain. This is known and understood. The experience is not diminished by this fact.
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We get it, you’re a shut-in that is scared of drugs.
The best thing about psychedelics is witnessing the power of the brain and it’s even more powerful than your vidya consoles brainlet.
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This thread is all about a fight between 2 scrotebrains arguing about some dumb perception cringe, LULZ these days…
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The important part is that you managed to find a way to feel superior to both while posting nothing of substance yourself, while complaining about no one posting anything of substance
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Shut up, drug is for degenerates embrace schizophrenia-induced psychosis instead.
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This is the most reddit post in the thread. Not even that anon, just thought I’d point out how scrotebrained you are and even further, not dignify your existence beyond letting you know. If you respond, I will not engage, I’m already exited out of the thread. Seeing this midwit reductionism only solidifies my theory that LULZ has turned into an even greater shithole than it once was due to immigration.
Goodbye scrotebrain.
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You sure know a lot about reddit, I’ve been using LULZ near exclusively since 2012
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>You sure know a lot about reddit, I’ve been using LULZ near exclusively since 2012
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Goodbye scrotebrain.
the both of you are so cringe please gtfo
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> Reality is an hallucination people share
> Drugs gives you a hallucination only you can perceive, so it makes it bullshit
> Except for the fact that people that take the same drug, can experience the same "hallucination"
uh?-
No they don’t
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>open a file with a program that is not supposed to decode it correctly
>I now see random shit instead of something that makes sense
Mystical.-
>be NPC
>open a thread about a topic your program can’t decode properly
>spout random shit instead of something that makes sense -
>thinks the homo-sapien brain evolved to perceive absolute truth
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on the contrary, we are built to perceive "the truth" in a narrow way, drugs fuck up this perception and we think there’s something else behind it. It’s meaningless
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Why do you have such a strong emotional investment in this scrotebrained idea?
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Your brain just processes information (reality). It doesn’t mean that the way it project said reality is in any way true or absolute. Taking drugs alters such reception of "reality", makes you experience stuff in a way you shouldn’t. End of story. I don’t even give a shit.
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Why are you so emotionally invested in the scrotebrained idea that "taking drugs" makes you perceive reality less accurately, though?
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it’s not a matter of precision. We already perceive reality in a non-perfect way. Imagine a bit stream getting decoded by a computer program so that the information carried within makes sense. Now if someone takes drugs it just alters the way the data is decoded. "More accurate" means that our sensory approach to the absolute truth makes sense. It’s not even accurate but it makes sense. With drugs it’s still not accurate but it doesn’t make sense because we aren’t evolved to experience a new sensory approach in that way
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What exactly are you basing this pants-on-head scrotebrained take on?
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explain why you think it’s scrotebrained and then maybe I’ll elaborate
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I’m not debating your scrotebrained view. I just want to know what it’s woke af on. Did you suck it out of your thumb as you were typing out that post?
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yeah alright fuck off
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So nothing? You did just suck it out of your thumb? That’s not much of a surprise given that you’re spouting scrotebrained generalizations about what happens when you "take drugs".
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I was kinda hoping you’d give him a counter-argument of some sort instead of just slinging shit.
Foolish of me to expect otherwise though. -
>I was kinda hoping you’d give him a counter-argument of some sort
Shouldn’t he make something that passes for a legitimate argument first? Imagine trying to make general points about "drugs" and thinking you’re coming off competent.
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you’re so deep in materialistic scientism. many such cases !
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our ego-minds have evolved to arbitrarily knight convenient social constructs as "the truth" in order to serve our survival strategies. these "truths" are subjective and relative – look at the vast array of world religions and cultural norms – all equally as "real" to the players of each system. science is another game we play: it has clear vast material utility, but science is not absolute truth, nor the products of scientific inquiry. it’s only when we remove the ego-mind that we can perceive the equivalent of a hard drive with no operating system installed. it’s the closest thing we can do to directly experience reality outside of the confines of any inherently biased, survival-orientated "thing" which otherwise imprisons itself within an "identity". i’m not talking about drugs generally, i’m talking specifically about psychedelics such as psilocybin, DMT, etc.
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where my 2c-b chads at
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[…]
>t. nonhuman with no perception
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>"yeah sis i saw sum colors and wicked patterns duude lmao"
>"it was super spiritual and now i see the bigger picture"
>still works wagie job
>still does not become homeless
>still does not make the great pilgrimage -
Psychedelics are an excellent tool for exploring the various mechanisms of consciousness first-hand. You could easily dismiss this experience as being non-evidence, but if we actually conducted studies using psychedelics, documenting responses to stimuli on a large portion of the population, it would be at least as valid as the field of psychology. (inb4 soft sciences are useless lol)
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Neuralink will do this in the near future
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Drugs fuck up your brain, causing it malfunction. Junkies see this as this as "seeing more of the universe" when it’s all in their head.
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psychedelics melt away all your social structures n shit, but also amplifies a lot of your more basic psychological structures. acid gives you a lot of crazy feelings, like sometimes you feel impending doom. pretty messed up tbh. but it’s like you knocked off the highest layers of your mountain of identity and being, and now there is room for you to pay more attention to other things. Time and money make no sense, but you sit back and realize you’ve never really appreciated something as simple as a tree in front of your house. And you text your friend who is also tripping at his own place and you’re just like duuuuuuude. this tree dude. Fuck man, it’s amazing. And the leaves stop being themselves and it’s like the skeleton of tree is visible and you can see all the fractals maan. and your friend is like dude when i was leaving i seriously stopped and looked at that tree for like forever
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>the human consciousness is at the same time as being a form of awareness and sensitivity and understanding. It’s also a form of ignorance. The ordinary everyday consciousness that we have leaves out more than it takes in. And because of this, it leaves out things that are terribly important, it leaves out things that if we did know them would allay our fears and anxiety and horrors and, if we could extend our awareness to include those things that we leave out, we would have a deep interior peace.
-Alan WattsBecause your consciousness has to deal with so much constant stimuli from your senses, over the years it learned what is immediately useful and what isn’t and should be filtered out. The filter is automatic and unnoticeable by design, after all, filtering something from your consciousness would naturally keep it out if your perception. "Expanding your consciousness" is basically just modifying or removing parts of this filter on your perception. Or it could also just fuck around directly with your perception and provide noise in the signals that get interpreted by your brain in weird ways.
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>Or it could also just fuck around directly with your perception and provide noise in the signals that get interpreted by your brain in weird ways.
It will do that, too, and so what? Unless you suffer from autism and take everything literally, that could be the key to many interesting insights.
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They see something they weren’t meant to see, only schizos are allowed to see it, they then develop a permanent dependency on the material.
They essentially block their passage forever. -
Psychedelics radical alter one’s perception and thought patterns, allowing one to rethink assumptions made about perception and thought.
Personally I’ve found psychedelics to be far more useful for introspection into my own behavior than for whatever is "out there", though. -
drugs makes you see the world how it is not, and plays with your senses which tells you which is true and wrong
only low IQ really benefit from those kinds of drugs, high IQ will either not care or try out of curiosity and be unimpressed (I was despite being a midwit) -
i’m high rn.
I did calculus 3 class baked couple hours ago. it was so good dawg, I learned so much & made like two new friends. Then I went and danced with my girlfriend after class was over. We invented a new dance called the California Stride. We danced to California Girls by the Beach Boys. I love her. I don’t show it enough. I love her though.The world is beautiful sometimes.
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