can a non kernel-level anti-cheat like VAC (Valve Anti Cheat) detect kernel-level cheat programs that are reading restricted memory?

can a non kernel-level anti-cheat like VAC (Valve Anti Cheat) detect kernel-level cheat programs that are reading restricted memory?

  1. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    WHO CARES NERD, GET SOME BITCHES

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      I'm a kissless virgin.

  2. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    no

  3. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    I always find gaymer "anticheat" shit hilarious. If you don't want people to cheat, then verify all the data on your server rather than in the client.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      fucking 100% this.

      not gaymer but how would you detect on the server side something like aim bot? it acts as a human but fast and accurate

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        you kick them out from the server you dumb fuck

        • 6 days ago
          Anonymous

          yeah, but how do you make sure it's a bot and not human? just ban everyone who plays good?

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            watch them, botters are not hard to spot basically ever

            • 6 days ago
              Anonymous

              so the solution is to hire a bunch of people to watch thousands of replays every day?

              • 6 days ago
                Anonymous

                Well no, like in my previous post I just said there needs to be some tooling to detect botting. Most bots in TF2 right now are extremely obvious in their movement patterns and some basic statistical analysis of the amount of kills they get, time to aim, movement etc will all very clearly highlight them for a small team of moderators to deal with.
                Of course, bot creators will get more and more fancy with things, if you look at OldSchool RuneScape they essentially have an ongoing arms race with botters like this as the bots become more and more human-like in how they play making their screening more and more difficult.
                Another option is just giving some way to report players though of course that actually works and is examined in a timely manner. Steam does have reporting but at times it feels like just throwing messages into the void, I don't know how many mods they actually have looking at such things.

              • 6 days ago
                Anonymous

                people will do it for free if they even remotely give a fuck, and anyone good enough to be botting will be under public scrutiny in some other form anyway.

                You're pretending that there's no way to stop cheaters other than invading everyone's privacy and subjecting them to a horrible breach of personal security at the same time, and there is. It's called report and verify, and you do it by volume (most reports to fewest per user), like most competent publishers do.

              • 6 days ago
                Anonymous

                never allow a machine to do man's job. ever.

              • 6 days ago
                Anonymous

                No the solution is to hire people to the VAC team that aren't blind and lobotomised.
                I really don't know what the fuck is wrong with them but all games using VAC are plagued by the most easily detectable (for a machine) spinbotters.
                When a given player constantly switches it's crosshairs between the coordinates 0,0 and a players head that's not hard to detect, unless of course you are assigned to the VAC team where they first blind and then lobotomise you.

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        statistical analysis

        you have no clue what you're talking about, please go away.

        seethe /v/edditor

        • 6 days ago
          Anonymous

          >statistical analysis
          but that would be much more difficult to do than just implementing a kernel-side watcher, nobody will ever do that

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      you have no clue what you're talking about, please go away.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      I mean that's usually already done in most games that have strong server authority (though sometimes compromises have to be made to make the game feel less ass as clients do have to always try to predict things and sometimes may have slight authority for reasons).

      The real tricky issue is in a game like TF2 where Sniper for example has a perfect hitscan weapon which 1 shots most classes instantly. This is hard for a human to do, but a bot can aimbot and send perfectly valid inputs to the server which will be accepted regardless of how much validation is going on. There's really no solution to this though which is why I think Valve doesn't want to torpedo their Linux support just in the name of invasive "anticheat" spyware to snoop on what sort of programs are running on people's computers, or trying to lock down their process more. In the end cheaters will always find new ways to aimbot that are more and more difficult to detect even for anticheat systems, the only solution really is manual human moderation and stuff like that (with perhaps some tools which detect suspicious activity and help filter through the vast amount of data).

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      based dedicated server og playa

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      Okay retard, thanks for making it clear you don't know how it works. Sanity checking input from clients is standard protocol. What makes aimbots work is that they emulate mouse inputs perfectly and send them to the server. The server can't tell the difference. This is why we have anticheat that examines memory for programs looking at the game, or just known cheat programs in general. Secondary examination systems exist, mostly ML, that can analyze these inputs and detect "perfect" play, but even still this often requires a human somewhere. Either in reporting the potential cheater, or when making the decision that the analysis is correct.

      Detecting cheating is about to become almost impossible without something like a handcam for every player. Modern webcams and computer vision are so good that they can view a screen and make decisions about the game. This is an absurd step above what old cheat software does, where it pokes and prods at memory to see the value of player/item locations. With the injection of some healthy randomness, a second dirty computer can see what's happening on the clean computer's screen and emulate imperfect mouse movement and send it to the clean computer playing the game. This is the zenith of cheating.

      Tldr serverside sanity checking only allows for you to catch input a client is trying to do that can't be done(flying, moving at a faster speed). It does not catch a client doing things that a client can normally do (like aim your gun).

      Thanks for coming to my TEDx talk

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      Common mistake. Vac can and does detect kernel cheats quite often.

      You clearly have no idea of what you're talking about.

      No the solution is to hire people to the VAC team that aren't blind and lobotomised.
      I really don't know what the fuck is wrong with them but all games using VAC are plagued by the most easily detectable (for a machine) spinbotters.
      When a given player constantly switches it's crosshairs between the coordinates 0,0 and a players head that's not hard to detect, unless of course you are assigned to the VAC team where they first blind and then lobotomise you.

      CSGO spinbots are not as easy to detect as you might think. I have a working spinbot for sneaks servers and several other custom server anticheats.

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        >CSGO spinbots are not as easy to detect as you might think. I have a working spinbot
        go back to pasting

        • 6 days ago
          Anonymous

          Go find a csgo public spinbot that bypasses sneaks

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            You're retarded.

            • 6 days ago
              Anonymous

              You're retarded.

              • 6 days ago
                Anonymous

                Nice one

  4. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    VAC is the single best argument for kernel level anticheat.

  5. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    How desperate would someone need to be to create a kernel level anticheat? Seriously it's just a game either get better at it or play a different, most likely better, game.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      Lmk what your experience playing tf2 is senpai. Really, go play an hour of it and let me know what you think, especially how I can "get better at it" enough to not get hit by spinbotting snipers. Ty in advance. And before you ask, there are no better online experiences than ones from tf2, sweatie

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        Single player games are by default better than multiplayer games.

  6. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    it's funny how a single low effort troll can derail a thread

  7. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    yes but you need admin permissions, how do you think a debugger read memory breakpoint works

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      You don't need permissions when you are in kernel space, you are literally at the lowest level.

  8. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    >playing a multiplayer game on public servers
    There's your problem.

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